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Section 123

THEAGES. My father knows perfectly well, Socrates, but he is pretending to you that he does not know what I want. For I have told him often enough.

SOCRATES. But earlier you were speaking to him without a witness. Now make me your witness, and declare in front of me what this wisdom is that you desire. If, for instance, you desired the wisdom by which men steer ships, and I asked you, "What wisdom do you lack, Theages?", what would you answer? Would you not say the wisdom of a pilot?

THEAGES. Yes.

SOCRATES. And if you desired the wisdom by which they drive chariots, you would say the wisdom of a charioteer?

THEAGES. Yes.

SOCRATES. The wisdom you now desire—is it a wisdom that has a name, or does it lack a name?

THEAGES. It has a name.

SOCRATES. Do you know it, then, but not its name? Or do you know its name as well?

THEAGES. I know its name.

SOCRATES. Tell me what it is.

THEAGES. What else could its name be, Socrates, but simply "wisdom"?

SOCRATES. Is not chariot-driving also a wisdom? Or do you think it is ignorance?

THEAGES. No, it is a wisdom.

SOCRATES. The wisdom by which we know how to manage horses?

THEAGES. Yes.

SOCRATES. And the wisdom of piloting is the wisdom by which we know how to steer ships?

THEAGES. Yes.

SOCRATES. Then what is the wisdom you desire? What does it know how to manage?

THEAGES. It seems to me, Socrates, that it is the wisdom by which one knows how to govern men.

SOCRATES. Does it govern sick men? For that would be the medical art.

THEAGES. No.

SOCRATES. Does it govern singers in a chorus? For that would be the art of a chorus master.

THEAGES. No.

SOCRATES. Does it govern those engaged in physical exercise? For that is the art of gymnastics.

THEAGES. Not that either.

SOCRATES. Then what sort of men does it govern? Tell me.

THEAGES. The men in the city.